15 | Care Plans Can Be the Heart and Soul of Your Lactation Private Practice

Leah: Let's dive in. Hi, Annie.

Annie: Hey, Leah, how are you?

Leah: I am doing very well. How about you?

Annie: I'm very good. It's always fun podcasting. I look forward to these days.

Leah: I know, and I'm excited today because we're talking about care plans, which I think is such a big part of what we do and how we can leave a visit with continued support right there for these families. So I'm excited to talk about it. But I know we have an awesome sponsor today. You want to tell us about that?

Annie: I really love our sponsor. Our sponsor for this episode is Practice Better. Practice Better is your all-in-one solution to managing your practice, automating repetitive tasks, and getting back to doing what you do best - helping clients. With Practice Better, you can automate your intake process, use templates to save time on writing your care plans and creating your recommendations. communicate securely with clients and even keep them accountable. Use code clear desk 20 to get 20% off your first four months. I know a lot of lactation consultants have started using Practice Better and the feedback has been great, which is why we were so happy they wanted to partner with us for this episode and definitely check them out.

Leah: That's awesome. That's a really awesome offer too - 20% off for four months. Wow, that's going to be some savings.

Annie: And Practice Better is well priced. It's competitively priced and there aren't any hidden costs with it. I also really like the way they handled care plans, the topic of our episode today. I feel like that is such a critical feature for us as lactation consultants, but before we get into why Leah and I love care plans and have decided to devote an entire episode to them, Leah, I know you've got a fun marketing tip for us.

Leah: So I think one way you can mark your business is to actually offer and advertise gift certificates. This has been something that has brought in a fair amount of business for us. I'll have a client who has a friend that is going to have a baby and they're like, hey, I want to buy this, and so we actually advertise it on social media. Sometimes I'll do a mention in a visit even. I'll have a client that's like, Oh my gosh, my friend Susie's pregnant and she has got to use you, and I'm like, hey, when you go to that baby shower, you know you could give her a gift certificate for us. We offer gift certificates. And to make it even easier, there's so many platforms that allow you to do gift certificates through the platform even. which has been a great way for us to just streamline the whole process. But I've had this be a great way to market and also gives you something else to talk about as far as like in social media and on different platforms to just talk about, hey, we offer gift certificates. This is a great baby shower gift. So that's my marketing tip for today.

Annie: I love that I have seen a lot of other lactation consultants using gift certificates and talking about combining visits to make packages, and I think you can get really creative about that. And you know, one of your best delegates in the world is a family who really was happy with the care that you gave them. They had their first baby; it's very likely they've got friends who were having their first babies, so give them away to share the love with their friends. They love it.

Leah: Yeah, passing the love around. Absolutely. So let's get down to business with these care plans. So let's talk about why care plans are so important in the first place. I know you have a passion about empowering families, and I'd love to hear your perspective on what a care plan can do as far as empowering the family.

Annie: Yeah. So we occupy as lactation consultants a very interesting position in healthcare, which is we're not doctors. We're not saying, okay, here's your problem, and I'm going to tell you what to do to fix it. We're more like therapists. We're going to help you do a lot of really hard work, but you're the one that has to do the work. I can't give you a shot. I can't prescribe a medicine. I can't put something on it to make it better. But what I'm going to be telling you to do is here's how to structure what you're doing right now in a way that gets you where you want to go. And so we have to have a way for our clients to have what we're telling them during the visit reinforced so that they can actually do it themselves, because there's no piece of this that we can do for our clients. All of it they have to do it for themselves, and so that care plan, I just feel like it is the most powerful tool that we have at our disposal and that what we're doing is providing these families with the resources and information they need to meet their own goals themselves and believe in their hearts and know in their hearts that they are the ones that did this work.

One of the things I love saying working with families and you come to them and after a couple of visits or they follow up with you later and they say, Oh, I couldn't have done it without you. And I always say back to them you did everything. I was just over here helping you along, giving you some good information, but you did this. You and your baby did this and I'm grateful to be part of it.

Leah: Yeah, I actually had an exchange over my secure messaging the other day about a mom was like, Oh my gosh, you're a miracle worker. Everything's so much better. And I said, I am just a cheerleader for a miracle worker. You're the miracle worker, you're the one doing the hard work. I'm just cheering you on and giving you the tools, and so she was like, Oh my gosh, that's so true. And it was just really neat to turn around that empowering them and saying, like, I'm not the one sitting in that chair 10 times a day pumping or nursing the baby or doing this hard work. That's you. I'm just giving you the tools that you need to get that work done. I think one aspect that helps empower the family is to create a care plan with the family because it does have to be something that they feel is doable, that they feel like my goal is this and a lot of times I'll be like, if you're feeling more led towards this as your goal, this is the care plan we'd want to do. If you're feeling more led that this is your goal, then this is the avenue we need to take and this is the care plan we need to establish, and really getting the family on board, the whole family on working together to create the care plan I think is what gives them that empowerment of what to do. I think a care plan also helps the family understand what we're recommending, and so that even though we were working together with them, we are more able to document my recommendations, especially when it comes to tough things like the baby needs to be supplemented, those kind of things, we really want to make sure that that it goes into their hands that this is what we have recommended. So I think it's a way for us to document our recommendations for sure.

Annie: And that's super important because we want to make sure that we have it written down somewhere, especially when there is an issue with the baby who needs to be supplemented, that we said this baby needs to be supplemented and here's how much and that's where, as lactation consultants, we have a window into what's happening with this family that they might not have time to cover during the pediatrician visit, or if they're coming out of the hospital or the NICU with kind of a templated plan and we see them. They have their place like okay, so you're going to go home and you're going to be triple feeding. And what gets lost for this family often is - because how can you remember everything that anybody tells you when you're in a hospital in the NICU - so no fault of what happens in the hospital. But they come home and they don't know how to move on from those initial instructions that they were told to give. It has happened to me and I'm sure it's happened to you where you have a family who comes home and is told, well just keep breastfeeding, but the baby isn't transferring milk and the baby showing signs of poor intake and not having diapers and we need to have it written down in paper. This is how much to supplement your baby and this is how to do it in a way that's going to get you back to breastfeeding where you want to be, versus just give the baby this much.

Leah: Right, right and I have it happen so often, especially in the first week of life. They're sent home on a triple feeding plan, but they're leaving 24 hours out of the hospital or 48 hours out of the hospital, and the volume is really small and they get this message, which is great. And the hospital is like, baby's tummy is super tiny. They don't have to eat that much. Don't worry, don't worry. And then it's three days later, and that volume needed to go up, and in that message, they didn't continue on to increase the volume. That's where I think just making sure that we have a very clear indication for the families. I think some of the things we want to include in a care plan is really very detailed, but in simple language, so we don't want to be really complex. Sometimes even we want to make sure they understand what does milliliters versus ounces mean, and sometimes that can get really confusing for families, so you want to be aware of how are they measuring and stay with that language.

Whereas one family especially if they come out of a NICU are saying they're taking 45 mL, and so I know with that family, my details, my language needs to be in mLs, because that's the language they're speaking right now. And then with another family that they're like, the baby takes one and a half ounces or so, then this family's going to understand it better if I put ounces in, or if that's not the case, at least explaining it to them. But I think what we want to include in the care plan is very brief, but the highest points of the plan that you have for them with details. I think that's so important. I know from my care plan, the very first part of it, I have kind of the big overview points, like if it's say, a triple feeding plan for the next blah, blah, blah. We're going to be doing this and it's a very, very quick read, and then below that, I'll go in breaking it down. What does that look like? What does that mean? Here's links for this, there's links for that, but making sure that if they were to just open it for a minute, that would be what they would see and they would get the biggest, highest points kind of overview. How do you structure your care plan? What's in your care plan, Annie?

Annie: I mean, it sounds very similar to yours. I will have just step by step instructions of this is what I want you to do. This is how I want you to do it. So it'll say, I want you to supplement this many times a day, this many ounces at a time. Do I want you to do it before feedings, instead of feedings, after feedings? When do I want you to take a break? I always make sure that I incorporate into all my care plans where the family is going to have rest, and I also incorporate how they are going to monitor their progress, and when I want them to get back to me, and what I want them to tell me when they are getting back to me. So I do try to make it really a step by step as simple as possible. I do try to stay away from jargon. I try to really just make it like I could sit and I could read through this and I could know what to do. I personally keep all my ... I have a whole library of quick text template protocols, so I have basically a lot of times I know I'm going to say things the same way every time, and so I just have that stored and ready to go and then I'll tweak it and add individual personal touches with it, because there are no one-size-fits-all templates, protocols. So if I'm referring them to a specialist, I do have here is what I'm seeing. Here is why I'm referring to this particular provider. What you can expect at the visit, and then I provide links that back up my recommendations. And I always like to tell my clients I'm going to give you a lot of links to back up what I'm saying. I read the internet, so you don't have to.

Leah: Yeah, that's a good way to put it. That is definitely a good way to put it. And I really like your point about making sure that they have a clear picture of when do they need to contact you or the pediatrician, when to or how to know that this care plan is working for them. I mean, I'll warn a lot of families we're going to start you down this path because it looks like this is what's going to be the most effective thing for the goals that you have, but that doesn't mean we can't tweak this as needed. So in three days or however many it needs to be, I'll have some signs on my care plan, like if you're seeing this happening, or if you're seeing that happening, we need to make sure that we communicate, or I'll definitely have big red flags on there if there's something that I'm really being cautious about. This is when you need to contact the pediatrician if there's bigger things that we're watching out for, but really leaving them with that, I think that's an area I think in medical world altogether, people will be like, Oh, no, that's fine. That's not a big deal, but a lot of families want to know when is it a big deal? When do I need to worry? So we might be able to go in and be like, oh, a little soreness might be okay, but if you're seeing X, Y and Z, that's not okay and we need to talk about this again, or that amount of diaper sounds okay for this day of life, but if you get to tomorrow morning and see it's still not there, then that's when you know, so things like that. I think really, again, coming back to this empowering the family, I'm not going to be able to sit there and watch over them 24 hours a day or even contact them 24 hours a day to check in and say, Hey, is this happening? is that happening? What about this? What about that? And I need them to take on the knowledge so that they can evaluate their progress and communicate back to me so that we can make changes, or if they're feeling like this really isn't working for me. I thought I could do triple feeding, or I thought I wanted this but now I don't and I'm really needing to reevaluate the plan so I think giving them that language can be helpful as well.

Annie: Definitely. I have a protocol for plugged ducts and it's all written out. So it's like anything I would want to tell anyone about plugged ducts and then I'll cut out what doesn't apply because I'm not telling everybody to do everything but I do have it all pre-written, but every time I give out the plugged duct protocol, I make sure that the client is getting the warning signs for mastitis so you know what to look for.

Leah: Absolutely.

And that gives them some security there to say, Well, I'm not just fumbling in the dark. And I think you and I both agree that that is where a lot of our parents, we come to see them, they do feel like they’re just trying and I don't know, and how do I know that this is working, and how can I tell? And so your care plans are here's how you're going to tell. Here's what you're going to do, and I think that it's not accidental that it's a CARE plan. It's not just here's your prescription, or here's what you're going to do. It's here's how you're going to take care of this, and here's how I'm caring for you, and here's how you're going to care for yourself and for your baby, and we can really communicate that in our care plans that we have put the time and attention into saying I believe in you, I want good things for you, I'm here for you, and you can check back in with me if it's not working. I communicate that to all my clients as well. I say I'm giving you what I think is... these are all the first things that I would try in your situation. If anything in this care plan is not working, please tell me right away, because we can always try something else. I've got a very rich set of resources. I've got a lot of ideas, but we'll start here, but if it's not working out, I want you to tell me.

I think that's so, so helpful, because then it leaves the parents not feeling like well, the lactation consultant came and she told me to do this, and this didn't work for me, so everything fell apart. No, there's a plethora of other avenues that we could take and I want to stay in communication with you so I can help you navigate which would be the best for your situation. And I think the last thing that I always put on my care plan is a timeline for progress. What's the expect progress? No, I'm not going to hand you this care plan and tomorrow everything's going to be perfect. This is what I expect and then I also always write my recommended follow up. So most of the time, I'm recommending some kind of follow up. Now, if they take that or not, it can vary, but most of the time, I'll recommend a follow up in two weeks, or I recommend a follow up in a week, or I recommend to follow up when you plan to return to work, those kind of things. I always make sure that that's at the end of my care plan so that they're aware of what I'm expecting us to need to do going forward, because I think a lot of times parents think it's a one-and-done and I make sure I communicate that especially in complex situations, it's not going to be one-and-done, and I'm here for you for the long haul. we need to meet again; we need to make sure that we follow through in checking on this aspect or that aspect. So I always make sure in my care plans I'm clear about that as well.

Annie: Definitely. I think that's really important. I think we've all been in that situation where we've heard where the client says to us, oh yeah. well, I don't know. My other lactation consultant told me to do this, and I think when we hear things like that, we kind of always go hmm sometimes, but then you remember what the client heard and what that lactation consultant said may be completely different things. I am positive that my New York City colleagues have sat in a room with somebody who saw me and had that person say, I don't know. Annie Frisbie told me to do this and it didn't work, and you know what? That's cool. I'm fine with that because I know that most of my colleagues are going to have that charity about this is just how this family interprets this.

Leah: Having a new baby, it's just so much information to intake and it's so overwhelming. I mean, your whole life has been turned upside down. So I think just like you're saying, when we have these care plans, and we can say the parent can come back to it and come back to it and reflect back on it because it is so hard for them to take in all that we're saying. And even though we might be very, very mindful through the visit not to overwhelm them, inevitably almost every time, especially in complex situations where there might be additional underlying factors going on, it's going to feel overwhelming. So I always reassure parents, don't worry if you feel like you can't remember what I said five minutes ago, it's going to be in the care plan.

The other thing that I do just as we're going to move on to the next aspect of delivery of the care plan, but the last thing I wanted to share about just what we include or how we create a care plan is that I always ask the breastfeeding parent and any support people? Is there anything that you want me to write down and put in your care plan, as highlight points that you want to make sure you don't forget. And so I'll tell them, usually in the beginning of the visit, let me know if you have any of those 'write that down' moments and I'll write it down for you and that'll be sent in your care plan. And that's how I kind of do those tweets from my protocols. I take it from their 'write that down' moments and it's fun because the mom, she'll get fun about that. I'll say something and she'll be like, write that down and I'll be like, Oh, no worries that's in my protocol.

Annie: That is so good. I love that. It brings them into the process. It really cements this idea that you said earlier, which is that you're creating it together. I really love that and during the consult itself, it is unlikely that those parents are going to remember what you said. What they're going to remember is how you made them feel and then you're going to include a lot of great information in there, but really you want to help them feel good about what is happening and what they're doing and how they can get even in the worst situations, you really want them to feel safe. And you want them to feel like they have a plan, and you're going to tell them in words what the plan is, but then when you write down the care plan and then they see it, they're going to read the same thing you said to them that they couldn't remember through the filter of how they felt when you were telling them about it. And if you made them feel good, while you were speaking these words to them, they're going to remember feeling good when they read them again and be more likely to implement them.

Leah: Annie, that was really good. I love that. I love that perspective. So let's talk about how we get the care plan to the family. So I know I'm talking to the paperless IBCLC over here, but some people still use paper care plans, and I think that there's some pros and cons to that. One, you're going to right at that moment be writing it down and handing it over. Instantly they're going to get it. It's handwritten so it has a touch of 'I sat here and wrote this for you' in my handwriting, and if you have beautiful handwriting, even better - I do not - but we used to do paper care plans in my practice and I did like some aspects of it, because it just felt very personal. I'm not clicking any protocols or anything; it felt very personal and was a little bit time consuming. We always had this aspect of I want to also send you a bunch of links and handouts and resources, and so we moved away from it just because of the aspects of now I have to do two steps. I have to write this care plan for you, which takes a little bit longer and then I'm going to go home and have to email you all these additional resources. So that got really time consuming, but I could see where some LCs would find it valuable to have a paper version right there. And if you are using the paper version, usually make sure you have a copy of it in their file, whether that be a shot, a photo of it that you've scanned into their file if you're using an EHR, or if you are taking a copy of it and putting it in their paper file. If you're still doing some paper charting, it's just important to have that because there's no way to get it back. And if the parent loses it, which happens all the time, like grandma's over and they're cleaning for you, and they're like, who needs this, or they misplace it. I mean, that seems to be what happened a lot of times is the family would call back and be like, Hey, we can't seem to find the care plan you left for us. Can you tell us what it said? Thank goodness, I always had a copy of it, but it definitely is another added step there.

Annie: I am certainly not against the paper care plan. I think there can be great reasons to leave something behind, especially if you know that it's going to take you a little more time to get those links together, and maybe your workflow is that you want to be able to leave a 48 hour care plan on paper with them. And then you have one morning a week where you type up all of your protocols, all of your digital care plans and send them out, so maybe you just don't want to be doing that per visit. You want to be batching that work and doing it once a week or twice a week or whatever it is. that might save you time and be more efficient for you, and you want to leave something behind and you might even say to them, I've got a care plan for you. can I put it up on your refrigerator for you? so put it somewhere they can find it so they're not going to lose it because I am 100% sure that I have clients that come home from the hospital doing things that don't make sense because a piece of paper fell out of their folder on the way home. I'm certain of that because there is no way. I know all the great lactation consultants that work in the hospitals here in New York City, and I know for sure that they didn't tell you that, that there's some miscommunication that was lost. So that is the big downside of paper is that it can get lost. it's paper. They can be really effective, and so when you're thinking about the upside of digital care plans, being able to add those links that you can click. That for me if you're evaluating a charting platform - 100% deal breaker for me - is if you can't click the links in the care plan and if what the client gets doesn't have clickable links, then it doesn't work for me, because I want them to get the email. I want them to pull it up on their phone, and at two o'clock in the morning, I don't want them doing a Google search for is my baby eating enough? I want them to say, Annie sent me a bunch of links. Let me read those and I'm very particular about the links I send. I send them from websites where I know if they went down a rabbit hole on that website, they will get good information. I don't send links that are like on sites that are sponsored content, like a site that's trying to sell them something. So I stick to articles written by lactation consultants. Other people that I like are Kelly mom or Breastfeeding USA, and by the way, if you love to write about breastfeeding stuff, they are so many topics that still need good articles on, so do not feel like it's all been covered. It certainly hasn't. So definitely, if you're a writer, just keep writing. Write it out.

Leah: And if you need any ideas, we've got like a thousand.

Annie: I know.

Leah: For sure. So the second way that you can, or another way would be on some of these platforms, and I know you can speak to this on some of the platforms that have a patient portal version. So how does that work?

Annie: Yeah, so a lot of the platforms will have where, in order to fill out the intake form, the client has to create an account in your platform, and then when you deliver the care plan, they can sign into the platform to view the care plan. So this is 100% secure. it's completely protected. there's no way for that data to leak. A lot of you might be accustomed to this from your physician. I know my doctor, I used to be able to email him, and now I have to use my thumb to sign into the app and then they only give me three choices of topics that I can email him about. So there's a barrier there but you don't have to have those barriers. it really can be as simple as they get an email to their inbox that says you have a new document, click the link and it opens right up, and a lot of times their passwords already saved on their phone and then they can look at it and see the links and a lot of them, they look really good. They’re easy to read, you scroll through, you can click the links, the links will open in another tab on your phones, then you can go back to it, and many of them are doing that. some of them are just allowing you the option of exporting a PDF version of the care plan so then you're exporting it and sending it by email, or if you want to have like - I have never done this personally - but I know people are doing this are carrying with them a little mini printer and printing out that PDF to leave behind. So you're not going to be able to click those links because there are going to be clients who are going to say ... I've never encountered this and you and I've talked about this a couple of times. I've literally never had somebody say, Oh, you mean texting isn't HIPAA-compliant? Well, never mind, we'll do secure messaging only. However, I have had some clients only use secure messaging with me, and so that's why I like having a way to share it with them. But even when I was using email, I just never had anyone who was like, this is unacceptable to be using email. just like get it to me.

Leah: I know. I'm trying to explain what it means and why this is HIPAA compliant, and they're just like, I don't know. just email it. I don't care how it gets to me. Just send it to me. But yes, it's important that they know they have the options for sure. But this sounds like probably this patient portal is the most secure way to send a care plan, and then of course, we have the version of emailing the care plan and that requires a little bit of additional consent and permission on our part. But I think it's probably the most commonly used way that lactation consultants are sending care plans. I know for me, this is kind of what we do. We, in our consent form, have permission to email and then I always ask the client in the visit. I let them know, hey, I'm creating this care plan for you. It's going to be sent to you by email unless you don't want it send by email and I can give you a paper care plan, which I do keep a pad of paper care plans from back when we used to do it. I had some left over, so I just keep it in my bag. I've never had anybody say, no, you're not allowed to email me but I always ask for permission and then I have it in my consent form. I think you could also have a different secure method. I know Spruce has options for secure messaging. You can send things, but email I think is probably the most common and you want to make sure, like you're always telling us, you're using a paid-for HIPAA-compliant email service, and then encryption is another layer that you can use to protect when you're sending out your care plans. Is there anything else you want to add to when you're emailing a care plan? What's the most important aspects?

Annie: Yeah, I think the ability to add a password is obviously going to create an additional layer of security to PDFs that you're sending, and some platforms will let you do that and never sending that password through email. I think also one thing I'm also reflecting on though, is back to talking about paper care plans is that if there are access issues for technology, and so there could be a lot of reasons why someone might not be able to process electronic information. So whether it's some not being neuro-typical, for example, that person might need information given to them in a different way, or if they've got a phone and they're like, all I do is text and I don't even have email set up on my phone. Are you going to ask them to set email up on their phone? No, of course not. You're going to figure out a way to text them that care plan because at the end of the day, the most important thing is that the client get a care plan that they can implement, and that is simple for them

Leah: That they can access for sure

Annie: Because if they can't get it, it's of no help to them. And so that really might mean that and I have definitely done this at consults, where I've said I'm going to write this down on a piece of paper for you. I've done that.

Leah: Yes. I keep a legal notepad in my bag, and then I keep these care plans in my bag at all times, because you never know when you do need to write something down and that can help carry over until maybe the moms like, you know what I'm not going to be able to get on my computer till later. could we just write a few notes down? and either the mom might write that down or I'll write it down for her if she feels like she wouldn't be able to access it right away, but it is so smart to ask. I mean, that's why I really implemented this aspect of asking, letting them know I send my care plans through email, if that's okay with you, but if you needed another way, let me know and letting that empower the family to say no, I don't work well with screens, or I don't have access or my computer broke and I can't look at it. I don't have email. I mean, there's so many barriers that could be there. they don't have a computer. So we want to make sure that we're getting it to them in a way that would work best for them, that's easiest for them to use, and being open to asking and not being so stuck in your workflow and how you have to get your work done, that you can be a little flexible if the family is needing that from us and then have the tools in your bag to do that for them, that you're not scrounging around their house trying to find a random piece of paper that you're like, you want me to write that down? I've got that right here and my purple pen too.

Annie: Because at the end of the day, a care plan that is full of the most beautifully curated links and recommendations is not as good as a piece of paper that says I want you to feed your baby on demand and read Kellymom.com. Because if the client is not going to read that long thing because they can't read it, but you were able to write down I really want you to just do skin to skin with your baby and count diapers and look at Kelly mom, and they're actually going to read that, that's good. I always say Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good, and the good in this case is meeting our clients where they are and giving them information that supports them on their journey.

Leah: Absolutely. Absolutely. That is an awesome point to remember and a great place for us to wrap up our care plan talk and move into your very awesome Annie's tech tip for the day. What you got for us today?

Annie: So our tech tip today is for our sponsor Practice Better, and I'm going to make a general point that when you're working with your clients, it's really great to have good naming conventions for all your client files. So say you're storing your client files in G-Suite, for example, it's so easy to all of a sudden end up with a gazillion files in there and you're like, no problem. I'll just be able to search the name of the file that I want. I do that all the time. My G-Suite is a hot mess. I don't never want anybody to see it. It's horrible. It's like under my bed.

Leah: Like that closet that you shove everything in before anybody shows up at your house. Yeah, I've got one of those.

Annie: That's generally fine for your life. Search can get you really far, but say I was using my G Suite to organize my client files, I need to be able to see a top-level view of everything that happened with my clients. So you really do need to have a folder on whatever platform you're using to work with your clients where you can see I did this visit and this visit in this visit, and here's the intake and here the care plans and here's the pediatrician report, where you're going to look at it all at once, versus what if I searched Leah care plan because I saw you and you are Leah, but I actually had eight clients named Leah, and they all come up. But what I don't remember is that the one time I saved your care plan, but maybe I saw you three times and two times I was like Leah care plan February, Leah care plan March, and then I was like Jolly care plan April. I'm not going to see it if they're not together, so have really good naming conventions for your files. name things the same way. I always recommend using last name, comma, first name, what the thing is and the date, and then that's going to have it be all the same. always name things the same way. So in Practice Better like in other EHR platforms, they have a way they're going to do that organizing for you, so you don't have to. So Practice Better has a client hub and you can use the client hub to quickly access information and your clients file when you're working on your notes, your care plans, or they also offer video sessions so you can use the client hub to be looking at everything all at once, and you can have multiple client hubs open at a time. So if you have one client hub for the parent and one for the baby, you can have them open at the same time so that makes that workflow pretty seamless, and I've definitely tinkered around with how Practice Better does that and I agree it's really organized and very easy to keep track of everything.

Leah: Anything that can help us stay more organized is so, so valuable. So I love that. Thank you so much for that awesome tip. Well, it has been great talking to you about care plans today. I feel ready to go out and empower families. I just love this reminder of what an important aspect of the work we do is what we leave behind or what we send to the family, and so I'm going to do better, for sure. And it was great talking to you today, Annie.

Annie: I love talking. This is a topic I just love it so much and I think we can just be so effective as coaches to our families and getting them where they want to go and see all the beautiful things happen that we are hoping for with every family we work with. So, have a great week and I will talk to you again soon.

Leah: Sounds good. See you soon, Annie.

Annie: Bye.

Leah: Bye.